[March 27th 2002]

The artist himself

Lawrence Malstaf
We have a tendency to forget it - or at least to not think about it - us art enthusiasts, who like to pop in to the exhibition space Nikolaj in the centre of Copenhagen, because this place appeals to us, with its engaging and experimental exhibitions; that this building is actually a church. However, with Hotel Pro Forma's current show Jesus_c_odd_size we become aware of Nikolaj in a completely new way. Imagery and rituals of Christianity once more enter the grand halls on Nikolaj Plads. By Julie Damgaard Nielsen

Exhibition Jesus_c_odd_size: 9th of March to 5th of April 2002

Nikolaj Udstillingsbygning
Nikolaj Plads, 1067 Copenhagen K
Tel. +45 33 93 16 26, fax +45 33 32 15 74
Mo-Su 12-17
admin@nikolaj-ccac.dk
www.nikolaj-ccac.dk

The concept for Jesus_c_odd_size, a combination of art exhibition, performance and theatrical show, has been developed in collaboration between theatre instructor/producer Kirsten Dehlholm of Hotel Pro Forma, playwright Gritt Uldall-Jessen and the Belgian artist Lawrence Malstaf.

Lawrence Malstaf has created nine large and quite overwhelming installations, so kopenhagen sent the artist some questions to find out more about his work.

Nicolaj by night

You are educated as an industrial designer; when and why did you decide to become an artist ?

I don't remember having taken any decision. As a child I used to like drawing and building camps in the trees. My father was teaching painting. As I learned a lot from him I didn't go to an art school. Studying Design was supposed to be a bit more economically promising but at the same time I got in touch with theatre and performance and started designing my first scenographies. Eventually these set designs (something to look at from a distance) developed into installations (something to experience from within).

(left) Lawrence Malstaf Mirror
(right) Lawrence Malstaf Rope

How did the co-operation with Kirsten Dehlholm come about ?

We met briefly in Copenhagen, in ´96 I think; after a project I did with Meg Stuart (Insert Skin 1, They live in our breath). But later in ´98 or ´99 she saw the Shrink installation in Vienna. In a production with Bilderwerfer. And she had said something like: Yes, that's what we need for Jesus. We met and she proposed the theme and the concept of the 24 parallel scenes or stations. She asked me to propose some new installations. I was more used to work with dancers and theatre directors but Kirsten had a much more visual and clear way of communicating. We spent many intense hours of brainstorming together.

Kirsten Dehlholm says of your installations that they "use space as an actor and the body as a fellow player". You have compared your own works with anti-automates. What does that mean ?

I'm interested in dynamic spaces and materials, the edge between balance and instability, change. In short spaces that are alive. Maybe it doesn't need to be a space but the point is to give the visitor an experience. Mostly it's a physical experience involving more senses besides the eyes. That's what I'm searching for at the moment: to trigger memories and emotions very directly through a bodily experience. I think therefore they might be more pure and intense than via the detour of intellectual analysis. You don't need to be smart to enjoy my installations. The first level is a primitive physical language. I like set ups for an individual visitor because this privacy avoids certain social rules and limitations. People seem more open and receptive to go for it than when they are observed by other people who might judge them. It's just you and the mirror for example.

From Hotel Pro Formas performance

About the anti-automates: I like to construct very specific set ups with timers and PC controlled motors, causing a certain movement of for example a rope, so there's a very precise mechanical process set in a loop but the result, the actual movement of the rope is changing, it is impossible to predict. Actually for this exhibition in Nikolaj I had to try to automise certain installations so that they could run autonomously for hours. It was very hard because the interesting thing about the rope for example is that it is not possible to repeat exactly the same process or to control all parameters.

The "spectacular" seems to be the connecting link between the
technological devices that you employ and the preaching of the church. What role does religion play in your life and other works ?

I don't really follow what you're stating here but I just want to say that the materiality of the installations, the machinery, may be cool but actually not relevant for me. I would prefer they were not necessary or invisible (but hiding them is equally unnecessary). The point is the experience you get, not the admiration for technology. I don't consider myself a religious person but I know there's a lot I don't know. There might be a link with religion in the sense that I relate to the term surrender. In order to fully experience something you have to give in to it, to let go of social or rational conditionings and restrictions.

(left) Lawrence Malstaf Virgin 2002
(right) Lawrence Malstaf Shadow 2002

It seems to me that you - within the scope of the individual
installation - work with contrasting aspects: for instance the human versus the in-human, exactness versus chance, stability versus change, presence versus absence, light versus darkness, the everlasting versus the perishable, the corporeal versus the mechanical. Looking at "Virgin" and "Shadow" you see the luminous figure in the window recess becoming a gloomy shadow on the opposite wall. Is it important to point out the "dark sides" of life - also when dealing with a sacred figure like the Virgin ?

No, this was more about copies, casts, mass production, reproductions, interpretation of an archaic and very valuable icon
Contrasts are only a technique to provoke something else; they are not a message in themselves. But it's interesting to hear that this is what comes across for you. I'm always very curious to hear what people experienced when I invite them in a new set up. Mostly I've seen it a 100 times through several prototypes before the actual ´machine` is operational. So it can be pretty hard for me to get an authentic experience myself. Besides with most
installations I don't intend to make any statement. I'm more interested in creating environments that trigger a certain state of mind, but once there it's the visitor who projects his or her associations. The Observatory may function as sunset, it invites you to open a certain register or quality from which only you know the content.

(left) Lawrence Malstaf Path
(right) Lawrence Malstaf Path, detail

What does the "divine" mean to you ?

Gee... Someone said it's the connection between head, heart and belly.

Does the concept of "memento mori" play a role in your works?

That's too difficult on a Sunday night

Christianity has always stressed that Jesus was a man of flesh and blood just like the rest of us, and this has for centuries made it easier for people to relate to the messages of the Bible. In "Golgotha", though, the crucified no longer seems human to me - the vacuum pack makes his body look unreal and his features seem impersonal. I know that this is a living, breathing person, but I can't help being reminded of a pack of meat in a cold counter. The plastic wrap acts like a membrane around the "crucified", and a distance arises between the spectator and the Christ-figure. Have we become more cynical when it comes to religious belief ?

I didn't design the Shrink in relation to Christ, Golgatha or death. And it was definitely not meant to look like a scary image inspired on wrapped meat. Of course I cannot deny that's what it looks like but they were not intended to exhibit. Kirsten asked to use them as a contemporary image for Golgatha. I designed them in ´95 (again as a physical experience), so people could in a rather private situation go inside, I would explain and guide them, have a conversation afterwards. This was very personal and interesting
to see that what you feel inside is opposite of what you see from outside. Someone called it the big hug. If you're able to let go of the first fear it becomes very relaxing and comfortable. You feel protected inside, a feeling of weightlessness and pressure. People relate it to the womb and rebirth. So maybe the experience itself would have been more appropriate than the
image of packed meat.

Lawrence Malstaf: Golgatha (also titled Shrink)

To pursue the ideas from my last question: Has the body - in some ways - become an impersonal, mechanical instrument ?

I wish not and hope that with my work I can contribute in the opposite direction. That is to make people more sensitive and aware of the interrelation between the physical and the mental/intellectual well-being.

Lawrence Malstaf: Sandbible

The Bible tells of important and established values like solidarity, salvation, charity and tolerance; you let the pages of the Bible disintegrate into a sandy, changeable heap. Why?

Because most of the stories come from an oral tradition that changed over time or were rewritten according to the convenience of this or that society. And yes Jesus wrote in the sand once. Jesus is not the bible but I don't think he intended to make a thick book, he wanted to communicate those essential notions you mentioned and every time and culture understands a different
language.

Lawrence Malstaf: Observatory

To use the body in an artistic context is a strategy known from body-art and performance; the artist uses him- or herself as "material". In "Mirror" and "Observatory" you also use the body - not your own though, but the viewer's. In the midst of vehemence, turbulence, variability and even disintegration the body sits there - motionless, contemplating. What ideas
do you, as an artist, have about this "core of stability" that occupy and "finish" your work ?

I mentioned this idea of surrendering before. It's a challenge to learn how to deal with our often chaotic environment and to find the beauty of it. Our perception of things is so coloured by our preconceptions and our state of mind.

...In a time where everything seems to accelerate logarithmically, our senses and how we use them must evolve as well. Definitely in the urban landscape we experience fast changing physical conditions like temperature, air quality, vibrations, movement, orientation and even (cabin) pressure. These are parameters that are mostly measured or controlled by technical means. More and more these quantifying sensors replace our biological versions. At the same time the usual communication technology stays limited
to audiovisual media. It forms a complex domain for psychosomatic research.